The Great American Retirement Myth: Is Everything We Know About Retirement Wrong?

SPEAKER_02 0:00

The problem is there are millions upon millions of people doing this and they're all gonna pass away. What happens to all those homes? Right now we have no inventory. That's why prices are so high. What's gonna happen when millions and millions and millions of houses go on the market within a couple of years?

SPEAKER_00 0:12

Medicare is mandatory and they will take that out, at least on SSDI. It's the second year that you're on it. They'll start taking that out. And I don't know too many people on either side, regular Social Security or Social Security disability who is going around making crazy amounts of thousands and thousands of dollars.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

Social Security is not going to be there because you have this other thing that no one in the financial community talks about. And it's called Medicare. And Medicare is your mandatory expense in retirement.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

If you don't know this today, it's fine. But can you explain to the audience simply how Social Security is, how it works, why it worked previously, and why that's no longer the best option. All right, all right, all right. Money is on my mind indeed. Yes, everybody. This is Darren Harbin, and I am your money counselor, and this is Financial State of Minds. This is the show where we help you get to that bag, manage that bag, and grow that bag as best as possible as we talk about financial literacy, financial education, and anything and everything to do with the almighty power of the dollar. And today I am here with another special guest. Um, as you guys know, I do talk about retirement. I think it's very important to have those conversations about retirement. Social security is an element of it, among many things. I am not the expert, so I felt it was appropriate to bring in an expert and informing the public what is going on when it comes to the world of retirement in general. Um, so I have Jim in the building today. Jim, welcome to the show. How are you doing today? Good, Darren. Thanks for having me. Thank you, Jim, for coming on the show. So um, this is actually perfect timing, um, Jim, because um I actually just came from a speech with my what is called the Silicon Valley Council of the Blind. And um, it is primarily um a population of seniors that were there. And um this retirement was on that mind after my speech was done. So this is a perfect segue, kind of I almost not an expansion, but just a perfect segue because they were actually asking me questions that I wasn't I could answer because I'm not the expert in that field. Um, I'm the expert at just personal finance, getting people to understand that um on that sense and a business sense as well. But um I know retirement is important. I know that there are many elements to it, and I know that we cannot we can't depend on our government when it comes to having enough money so that when we're 65, we can comfortably retire. Um, and that's where me and you align, and you know that way better than me. Um, but we forward to sorry, before we get into that, I always ask my guests this first question. Um, who is Jim? How how would you describe yourself?

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Well, my name is Jim Capulano. Um from Long Island, New York, live in a town called Babylon. Uh, been here most of my life, spent some time in Massachusetts right around college. Uh I played hockey up there before college. So I was up in Massachusetts for about six or seven years. The rest of the time born and bred Long Island. Uh started in the financial industry in 2007 as an advisor, was in that industry until 2012 when I left the advisory side and went into wholesaling. And from 2012 up until right now, I've been wholesaling to the financial community, helping them on the insurance and protection side. Um, and from there, I came up with this term I call the Great American Retirement Myth. Um, I have a book coming out on it next month called The Great American Retirement Myth. And it's the premise of what we're going to talk about here is how the government has changed the rules in retirement and the financial industry is just lagging behind in changing the way they help people plan. So I'm, I don't know, you people say, you know, that the term disruptor, I don't think I'm a disruptor per se, but I am kind of the guy out there just telling everyone that things are going wrong and you're not doing things correctly. So as you can imagine, I have a lot of enemies in the financial community, but that's okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:42

I can only imagine, man. It's kind of uh change course, man. You know they don't like that in any industry.

SPEAKER_02 4:47

No, they're making too much money.

SPEAKER_00 4:49

Absolutely. Absolutely. So um, so my first question is to you, um, as I'm learning with the audience. So you say there it's it's there's a myth. We're being told one thing and something else is happening. So let's clarify for the audience, so we're all on the same page, from your perspective, what is the myth that is being told to the average everyday American when it comes to retirement?

SPEAKER_02 5:15

So first let's define what a myth is. A myth is a story, no matter how outlandish or not factually based, that's passed down from generation to generation and just taken at face value, because it's like, well, that's what's always been said. That must be what happened. We don't need, we don't need any facts to prove it's true. We just believe it. That's the American retirement. If you think about the way people save for retirement, they're doing the exact same thing that their parents and maybe even their grandparents did for retirement. Think about anything else in our world that you do the same as your parents and grandparents at their age. You don't drive like they did, you don't watch TV like they did, you don't cook like they did. There's no medications that you're taking that they took. Surgeries are different. Everything has evolved except the way you save for retirement. You sock away money in qualified plans, whether it's 401ks or IRAs or 403Bs, you take the rest of your money that you can invest and you put it in non-qualified accounts, whether it's brokerage accounts, manage money, stocks, bonds, crypto. And then you depend on Social Security, because unless you're in a specific job that does not, a government job that does not pay into Social Security, that's going to be your basis for retirement, unless you have a pension. And as we know, pensions are getting less and less popular in the country. So Social Security is your base. Then you have your qualified money, which means you haven't paid tax on it while you're working. It's grown tax deferred, and you're going to pay tax on it later when you take it out in retirement. And then you fill in the gaps with your non-qualified money or your liquid assets, your liquid investments. So the myth is why are you deferring taxes? That makes no sense. It made sense in the 90s, it makes no sense now. And you're basing your income thresholds on Social Security. And Social Security is not going to be there for you. And here's the misconception: people think it's because Social Security is going to go bankrupt. Social Security is not going bankrupt. Social security will always be there. Social Security is not going to be there because you have this other thing that no one in the financial community talks about. And it's called Medicare. And Medicare is your mandatory expense in retirement. It is your one mandatory expense. I ask people all the time, you have one mandatory expense in retirement. What is it? And I hear all the time, it's taxes. Absolutely not taxes. You don't have to pay taxes. Nothing says you have to earn an income that you have to pay tax on. You can have zero income and not pay tax. But if you want your social security check, you have to enroll in Medicare. And your Medicare premium comes directly out of your social security check before you get it. And what no one talks about in the industry is Medicare is inflating at a rate way higher than the cost of living on your social security check. And there's this thing called Irma, it's an income-related monthly adjustment amount. That is how much more you have to pay over base Medicare based strictly on your income level. The more you make in qualified money in retirement, the more your Medicare premium is. The more your Medicare premium is, the lower your Social Security check is. And now you've been deferring taxes all this time. So now you have a big nest egg of qualified money that is fully taxable. Every dollar of that gets counted towards your Irma surcharge. So the only thing that's protecting Medicare and Social Security is the financial community. We're making sure it never goes broke. Because the more qualified money we have people saving, the more tax that they have to pay in retirement, the less that the government actually has to pay them in social security benefits. That's the myth. The myth is defer taxes, wait as long as you can to claim social security, and you're gonna be fine because you're gonna have all these assets. You're gonna be in a lower tax bracket. That's what they tell everyone. You're gonna be in a lower tax bracket in retirement. Also completely false.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

Right, right. So you said a lot there. So but what you said on the end is very true. And that's what I tell the people that I work with is what is this idea that we defer our taxes now when and get taxed later? And I'm sure you you know this better than me because you're you're older than me. When has taxes ever gone down?

SPEAKER_02 9:57

They they went down a couple like 10, 15 years ago, they started coming down. Now we're at historic lows. If you look at the effective tax rate, the average effective tax rate in this country, it's as low as it's really ever been. You know, so so it's insane to think that taxes are gonna go down in the future when we're at historic lows. Look what happened in the mortgage, uh, the you know, the interest rates, the mortgage interest rates from 2008 to 2019. We were at historic lows, and everyone kept saying, eventually they're gonna go up, eventually they're gonna go up.

unknown 10:29

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

And where do they go? Because when you're at low, you can only go up. So now we're at higher rates, still historically speaking, pretty low rates, not historically low, but low rates, and everyone's going crazy because we're at a six and seven percent rate instead of a two or three percent rate. When our taxes are at historic lows, where's the only place they can go? Right. They can only go up. So why would you defer money? This is what I it drives me crazy when you hear people say, Oh, it's great to defer your taxes. You're deferring money now at an at a tax rate you know, you know what the taxes are right now. And you're deferring a lesser amount because you're only gonna defer on that dollar. You're letting that dollar grow to 10, 15, 20 dollars, and you're gonna pull it out then in retirement. Who knows what the tax rate's gonna be? Most likely be higher. And here's the biggest problem with that you're choosing to pay taxes when you're most vulnerable because now you're retired, you're you're older. You can't work, you can't earn more money. If you're in your 30s, 40s, and 50s, if you need to make more money, work more. You can always subsidize while you're working. You can't do it when you're 80. You can't do it when you're 75. What are you gonna go back to work because you're you know your taxes, taxes went up and your qualified plans getting withdrawn too fast? It just makes no sense. You pay the devil now, pay the devil you know.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

Right, and I and I agree with you. I say the same thing to my audience. So let's go back a little bit again on this concept of there's a there's a myth. I like your term myth, but let's just be real misinformation floating around about social security. So uh can you uh you may, and if you don't know this, uh it's fine, but can you explain to the audience simply uh how social security is, how it works, why it worked uh previously, and why it that's no longer the best option now?

SPEAKER_02 12:30

Sure. So Social Security is a government program, it's a government subsidy program, it's a it's a socialized program for people in retirement to get guaranteed money. And you pay into it during your working years. And the idea is as you're paying in, that money is being invested by the government in whatever they do. That money is growing, and then people that are in retirement are able to pull out pull from that fund. So while I work, I contribute and I take care of the folks that are retired now. When I retire, the folks that are working will take care of me. That's kind of the idea.

SPEAKER_00 13:08

Right.

SPEAKER_02 13:09

The problem with it is if you look at the demographics in our country right now, the largest portion of our population is in or near retirement age. There's a lower population in the workforce. So less money is going in and more money is coming out, and that's why social security keeps going down. Not to mention the government keeps tapping into it for things they're not supposed to tap into it for, but it's a different discussion. So when you are at retirement age, you can start Social Security as low as 62, and you can wait until your 70s to start taking it out. The longer you wait, the more you earn because now your life expectancy is lower. The idea is you're still going to get the same amount of money. You're just going to get at a condensed age or stretched as condensed time frame or stretched out time frame.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Got it.

SPEAKER_02 14:01

So a lot of the old adage in the financial industry was wait as long as possible to go on Social Security because that's how you get the biggest monthly check. And at face value, that's true. That's how you get the biggest monthly check. But when you look at it and look at what it means to your taxes, what it means to Medicare, and how long you have to live to break even, most of the time it doesn't make sense to wait past age 67. So we're telling people like that's a myth, also. You know, you have to really look at your numbers, get break-even numbers as of how long you have to live every year you're thinking about deferring your social security check. And then the biggest part with Social Security that not a lot of people know, including the financial community, which is shocking, Medicare premiums, which are mandatory, come out of your social security check. And last year, Medicare went up by over 9%. So you know, a 9% increase, there's something called the Hold Harmless Act that says your social security check won't go down if the cost of Medicare outpaces the cost of living. But that only protects part B. So your med your social security check might not go down because of part B, but it's not going to grow. And as we see in everything we do, things get more expensive. You need more money in your life. If your social security check is stagnant, you're losing money. Right. Excuse me. So that's the biggest misconception we see with Social Security is people don't realize what an impact Medicare is going to have on your retirement. And you have to plan for it. And no one in our industry really does.

SPEAKER_00 15:55

Right. And one thing I'll add is everything you say is my understanding also accurate to what affects me personally, which is social security disability insurance. Um, so saying concepts, it's it's it's affecting you, like you said. I didn't know that. And I'm so I'm guilty when you say financial uh, you know, people in the space don't know. I didn't know that. I didn't know that until I gone on it through our disability. That um, yeah, like you don't have a choice. Medicare is mandatory and they will take that out. Um, at least on SSDI, it's the second year that you're on it. They'll start taking that out.

SPEAKER_01 16:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:36

Um, and I don't know too many people on either side, regular Social Security or Social Security Disability, who is going around making crazy amounts of thousands and thousands of dollars. I've never I don't know too many people making five, six, seven grand a month on Social Security. That's typically not it. It's typically lower to where you need every single dollar.

SPEAKER_02 16:59

Yeah, well, what's scary is you know, if you look, you can go to SSA.gov quick calculator, and you can put in your age, give or take what year you want, year and month you're planning on retiring, and your income, and you can look at what your inflated dollar amount is gonna be at your retirement. And the numbers are staggering. I just did it with a couple that was in their 40s, and I said, Oh, by the time you guys retire at age 67, you're gonna get $17,000 a month in Social Security. And they were like, There's no way, that's crazy, that's a lot of money. I said, It's not that much money, it's 27 years from now. That's the equivalent of $6,000 now. That's what everyone gets. You know, so it's not, it's $17,000 isn't an insane amount of money 27 years from now. But what's not moving up at the flate in at the rate of the inflation are the tax brackets. You get taxed on 50% of your social security unless you make too much money, then you get taxed on 85% of your social security. Those numbers are not increasing the way social security payments and inflation is. So basically, everyone in the future is gonna pay tax on 85% of their social security just based on their social security check. Then Medicare comes off of it. But here's the worst part say by the time you and I retire, Medicare is $1,000 a month, and we're gonna get $8,000 a month on our social security check. We net seven, we pay tax on the eight, even though we never got it. So you're paying tax on money that never hit your pocket because the government takes it to pay for their other mandatory program.

SPEAKER_00 18:50

Wow, I didn't even know that. Jesus. Um okay. Oh shoot. Again, this affects uh the disabled disabled community because that you know that's now. Like I said, my my first real year when it comes out is gonna be next year. Um I didn't know 50% of that money is taxable income. That's that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 19:12

50% if you make less than $44,000 a year as a couple.

SPEAKER_00 19:18

Do you know why that is? Like it's just a threshold.

SPEAKER_02 19:22

So if you're if you're below that number, you only pay tax on 50%. If you're above that number, you pay tax on 85% of it.

SPEAKER_00 19:28

But why why is it? I mean, do you know why or why do you think that you have an opinion on why is it so high for Social Security? Like, you know, that you know, that's affecting the population, like you said earlier, who is who has the hardest time working. So I wonder why the government would put a 50% tax on that particular type of benefit. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 19:50

I'm sorry, not a 50% tax. You're taxed at ordinary income on 50% of the benefit. Got it, got it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry, yeah. Not no, if it was a honestly, a 50% tax probably isn't far off, but no, it's your ordinary income tax on 50%.

SPEAKER_00 20:06

Got it, got it. Okay, okay. Um, still a little too high, but still not still probably higher than it should be. But that that makes it.

SPEAKER_02 20:15

Yeah, and I'll be honest, most people are paying tax on 85% of it.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

Yeah, no, that makes that that may that's crazy. Sorry, I'm just I didn't again, guys. This affects me personally. Like um, anybody who's on SSDI, which is a whole population of people, um, I'm sure this is if this is news to me, then this is news to you.

SPEAKER_02 20:35

Yeah, well, and and SSDI, even crazier, you're on the hook for Irma if you make too much money. So now think of somebody that's worked most of their life, saved up a lot of money in qualified plans. They something happens, they have a life event, now they're on SSDI. At some point, they can either start to choose to take money out of their qualified plans, or if they don't, the government tells them they have to in the form of an RMD required minimum distribution. If you're on SSDI, you're probably not obviously not able to work because that's the definition of SSDI.

SPEAKER_00 21:15

Right.

SPEAKER_02 21:16

But if you have, if the government now says, hey, you have to take out $150,000 from your 401k IRA, they add that to your SSDI, they add that to other any other income that you might have coming in through investments. Now all of a sudden you're making too much money. That'll put you in Irma, meaning you're not paying the base Medicare. You're paying Medicare plus something. So the way Medicare works is the government pays 75, you pay 25. The more money you make, the lower their contribution goes and the higher yours goes. It's just another progressive tax. So think about anyone on Social Security or even SSDI that has all this quality. Money because remember, your advisor told you and your CPA told you it's important to defer taxes.

SPEAKER_00 22:06

Right.

SPEAKER_02 22:07

You're just creating a time bomb for yourself in the future when you're most vulnerable. Not only on the tax side, but on your mandatory health insurance.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

Okay. So you said something right there. CPAs, financial experts, they're advising people to tax defer. And I know why, because up front, that sounds good, right? You know, don't pay taxes now, pay taxes later. But we know, like you said, this time bomb is happening to where you're setting yourself up and you're setting your family up to be in a situation where you're gonna pay higher taxes at an age where you're least likely to afford it. So, from your perspective, why as a community are we continuing to inform our clients like it? Does it just go back to what you said earlier? Like we just don't know better.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

No, they most of them know better. Um, I'm gonna give two very cynical answers. And this isn't the case for everybody, but let's make cynical answers because they're more fun. Absolutely. First cynical answer is greed. Yeah. If I know that I can contribute $24,000 to my retirement because I'm gonna get in a $6,000 write-off. So really I'm only putting $18,000 or $1,500 a month away. I can do that maybe. So that's what I'm gonna do. Now my advisor is thrilled because he's getting paid a percentage on the $24,000 every single year, plus the growth. He's building his Nest Egg, he's building his asset base. He's in AUM's assets under management. He's charging 1% for this case, um, 1% on all the money he has managed. So if he's got 10 of me, he's getting $240,000 a year. If he's got 100 of me, he's getting two, you know, $2.4 million a year that he's getting to charge 1% on every single year plus the growth. But what happens now if I say, you know what, I don't want to defer taxes. I could still only afford the $1,500 out of my pocket a month. So I'm gonna do a Roth, but I'm only gonna put $18,000 in my Roth. The advisor just lost $6,000. Now multiply that by $100. He just lost $600,000 under management. Compound that over 10 years. So an advisor is building a book of business. He's got a business just like any other business owner. Most business owners, their retirement is their business. At some point, that financial advisor is going to want to retire. And the way they do it is they sell their book of business to another advisor. And the only thing inside of it that has value is assets under management because they pay a continuous commission. Right. Now, if my assets under management are 50 million, I'll get a nice payout. If they're 25 million, I'll get a nice payout still, but it'll be about half the amount. So they want to grow the asset as much as possible. And the best way to do it is get more bang for your buck by deferring taxes. The other reason, it's cookie cutter, set. They don't have to argue. You don't have to argue with a client to put money in a 401k. You say, hey, listen, I have your 401k. I'm and I'm the broker and company XYZ. This is what you do. You're a new hire. Choose this mutual fund, this mutual fund, this mutual fund. Put as much in as you can. You don't get any pushback. It's free money. Now, if he comes in and says, Well, you could do this, but you realize that down the road it's gonna mean this. And if you protect your social security, he's gonna he's gonna spend time and put in effort to make less money. It's human nature. No one's gonna do it. And then as accountants go, I mean, let's be honest, an accountant's job is to get you to pay less taxes today. That's their job. No, I say this all the time. No one's ever referred their accountant to a friend because they've paid a lot of taxes. No one said, You won't believe you gotta talk to this guy, he's the best. You won't believe how much I paid in taxes. I got killed. Nobody refers an accountant for that. It's right this guy's the best. I paid nothing in taxes. So the more they can defer, the better they look. They're not thinking 30 years down the line. That's not their job as the accountant.

SPEAKER_00 26:32

Got you, got you. And there's something that um I mean, you're you're you're this is one of the few episodes. I'm like, this dang, that is never how it's adding up and makes sense. This is a real issue. So, and one thing that you mentioned, and it's so true, is that um most of most people in the financial industry, their service is around you saving money, saving money or investing as much money as possible. So it makes sense that they're the way you broke it down. The second one you is what I thought of. The first one is is true too. It's the way you broke it down. They're making money from you investing now, they're making money from you tax deferring now. But that's not ultimately always gonna be your best interest. It might probably not gonna be your best interest in initially. So I guess my follow-up question, just curiously, is should people uh continue to use these people? I mean, like we all, you know, people like me, I'm a business owner. I need a CPA, I need a tax attorney, I need all these people to just execute, let alone save me money now. So what do you personally tell people who are just kind of in this pickle of like, well, not most of us are not making enough money now, so we need to tax defer now, but then at the same time, hey, we need to set ourselves properly up for retirement. Kind of like, how do you kind of balance that conundrum that we all may be in right now?

SPEAKER_02 27:59

So, what I would say is as bad as you think your situation is now, think about how much worse it's gonna be when you have no ability to earn income. So, like I get it, like things are expensive, cost of living is very, very high. It's it's the you know, housing costs are through the roof. Everyone's struggling somewhere, somehow. You can do things to cut down on expenditures now. When you're 80, what are you gonna do?

SPEAKER_00 28:31

Right.

SPEAKER_02 28:32

Like what you have is what you have. You can't earn more. You know, like if you need to go to a doctor and pay for a medical procedure, you have to go to the doctor and pay for the medical procedure. If you don't want to go out to dinner every Saturday night now, you can stay home and cook. You know, so I get it. Like everyone needs enjoyment. Everyone wants to spend money because they want to enjoy their life. I'm well, I'm like the worst financial advisor in the world when it comes to that. Like, I'm I like spending money, I like living life now. But what is important for people to understand is you have to keep an eye on when you're vulnerable. So take as much tax burden on as you can now. And if you explain that to your accountant and you say, hey, I just want to make this very clear. I understand that I want to, you know, we're all on the same page here. I want to pay as little as little tax as possible here, but I don't want to do it by deferring. So find me my write-offs, find me my deductions, find me the things I'm able to do. I don't want to defer money. My savings for retirement is gonna be in a Roth. I'm gonna pay the pay the piper now. This way, I don't care what the government does in the future. They can change all the rules they want about tax rates in the future. It has no effect on me. So that's what I would tell people. And it's it's an uncomfortable conversation to have. And as you can imagine, having these conversations with financial advisors is very, very difficult. Having these conversations with accounts is very, very difficult. They get it, they understand it. And then I was like, Do you have any idea what that would do to my business if this is what I was telling my clients? I was like, but that's your job. Your job is a fiduciary, right? You just have to give them the information, let them make the decision. And mind you, I have dozens of amazing financial advisors that understand this. And they're actively working on it. Like, you know, I had they had aha moments with me three, four, five years ago. And and they've changed, they're not changing their practice, but they're implementing in their practice. They're letting people know, like, hey, this is out there, you got to keep an eye on this. Do you are you sure you want to defer money? As long as you give them the information, if the client decides to do it, it's on them. You you gave them the info.

SPEAKER_00 30:50

Got you. And then just for again, clarifying, clarifying and deeper understanding for the audience. So I know this. There's, you know, there's ways we can lower our tax bills. So we talked about these terms, write-offs. There's also, you know, a deduction, um, and then there's the tax credits stuff like that. But then, like you said, there's deferring, there's deferring to later. So, what is the most let's just, if we can give three very common ways every person has an opportunity to tax defer.

SPEAKER_02 31:21

So 401k IRA, 403B, that's the most popular one. It's the gold standard in retirement, it's what everybody does. Um, another way to defer that actually is not a terrible way to do it, is an HSA health savings account.

SPEAKER_01 31:35

Right.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

So you would have to have a high deductible health plan if that's an option at your employer. Look into it. It's going to give you lower premiums on a month-to-month basis. So you'll be saving money on your premium, but it's more out of pocket every time you go to the doctor. The nice thing about it is you're allowed to have uh a savings account, a health savings account or an HSA that you put money in tax defer just like a 401k. But here's where it's important: as long as you use the money for qualified health care expense, you never pay money, you never pay tax on the dollar. So HSAs are a really, really nice way to defer. Um and then, like after that, you have all sorts of you know, exotic retirement plans. You have cash balance plans, profit share to find benefits, defined contribution pay plans. Those are more for the high income or the people that's looking to defer $200,000, not $24,000 or $26,000. Um, again, same problem, just bigger bomb at the end of that. If you're deferring $200,000 a year, it means you're making a good amount of money. Um, you're used to a certain lifestyle, you're gonna expect to keep up that lifestyle in retirement. So you're gonna have to make an awful lot of money in retirement, and you're gonna have a huge tax bill deal.

SPEAKER_00 32:53

Got you. Okay. So I think we're all the audience and I are all like, okay, didn't know this stuff. Like you said, I if I didn't know it, I know 100% of my audience doesn't know this. Okay, so uh you just gave us the information. Now we're woken up. We're woke. So what can we do? So, what do you recommend a person? Let's just take me. Hey, I have a uh, you know, I'm I'm self-employed, I have a uh nonprofit of four people. Um, I have a decent amount of money, um, but I am on social security disability. So I'm on kind of this hybrid. So maybe I'm not the best example, but generally speaking, just from a starting point, how how do you tell people to move now that they know now that we know this information?

SPEAKER_02 33:41

So we have a couple of different, a couple of different game plans depending on your age and your situation. Um, if you're contributing, so I have in my mind, I have three different segments of the population. You have people that are retired, then you have pre-retirees, those are the people that have most of their savings done. Now they're planning on retiring in the next five to 10 years. Then you have income earners. That's like anywhere from your mid-30s, and obviously the age can change, but generally the mid-30s to the early 50s. That's when you're in your height of your earning years, you're starting to make money. You're now all of the little things that you had to spend money on to get yourself ready to live your life are behind you, and now you have extra money to save. So you have your income earners, your pre-retirees, and your retirees. Obviously, the older you are, the harder it is to change. The good news is the older you are, the less Medicare and Social Security gonna hurt you because you have less of a window for the compounding impact on the cost. So for retirees, we talk to them about spending down their qualified assets as early as possible. Spend it down even if you don't need it, because once you pay tax on it, it is just now non-qualified money. You can reinvest it. So now you're not paying ordinary income, you'll only have to worry about capital gains. We talk about the need for annuities. Um, annuities are one of the four-letter words I use in the financial industry. The other is life insurance. Annuities are important because they are the one and only product an individual can purchase that can guarantee they never outlive their income. So, what we show people is your social security is never going up. It's just not happening. The cost of Medicare is going to outweigh the cost of living inside of your Social Security. And when you add in your Part D premiums and maybe Irma, your social security check is actually gonna go down. So as you're getting older and more vulnerable, and the cost of living is going up every year, your only guaranteed source of income is going down. So you need to take a portion of your money and put it into a product now that when you get to the point where you need more guaranteed income, you can turn it on and you know for the rest of your life that money's gonna be there. That's in an annuity. Gotcha. Financial advisors don't tend to like annuities. Why don't they like annuities? Because it takes money out of their assets and puts it into a non-ongoing commission product. Meaning when they go to sell it, there's no value in a book full of annuities. So that's my advice for them. Look at spending down your qualified income. Look at an annuity. Um, big thing that we talk about is consider a reverse mortgage. I know that's another like crazy idea that people are so against. I'm not saying it's for everybody by any stretch of the imagination, but if you have a home, everyone thinks that they want to leave the home to the kids. Kids don't want your home. They don't even know it yet, but they don't want it. Because if you look at our real estate market, I think that there's a bubble about to burst, mainly because no one's moving out of their forever home. You you look at the, you know, you get your starter home, then your forever home. And then after your forever home in retirement age, you downsize. And then the people that were in the starter home move into the forever home. If you look at it, the people never left their forever home because we had such low interest rates for so long. They refinanced, they got another mortgage on it. And now they're like, well, I don't want to move to a condo in Florida at 8%. I'm living in a you know, a 3,500 square foot house in my home, and I have a 2% mortgage rate. So why would I do that? So they're planning on leaving those houses to their children. The problem is there are millions upon millions of people doing this, and they're all gonna pass away. What happens to all those homes? Right now we have no inventory. That's why prices are so high. What's gonna happen when millions and millions and millions of houses go on the market within a couple of years? The value is gonna plummet. Right. And now your kids are stuck with this house that they have to give away because there's four houses for sale on the block, or they have to continue to pay the upkeep and the taxes on it until they get an offer they want. So don't make them do that. Take a reverse mortgage out, help your income now. If the kids want the house when you pass away, they can refinance the mortgage and buy it. If they don't, they just say, give me the equity that the bank can have it. See you later. I don't have to worry about it. So another, like, it's a I don't sell reverse mortgages. I have nothing to do with reverse mortgages, but they're one of the things that I tell people they should really start considering because it's another source of income you're gonna need.

SPEAKER_00 38:18

And for the and for the audience, can you uh break down exactly what a reverse mortgage is?

SPEAKER_02 38:23

Sure. I'm sorry. Yeah, so a reverse mortgage is a deal with a bank just like a mortgage is, except you're giving them your home, the equity in your home, and they're giving you a monthly payment for it. So say you have a $500,000 house, they'll look at it and say, hey, we'll give you, I'm just making up a number, we'll give you $1,500 a month. You take that $1,500 a month or $18,000 a year, you hold on to it for 10 years. There's an interest rate on it, so $180,000 of payouts. Maybe the interest rate comes up and the mortgage is $250,000. The bank says, hey, either give us $250,000 to your heirs and get the house back, you know, take a mortgage out for $250,000, or the house is ours and you can sell it for the equity.

SPEAKER_00 39:12

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_02 39:13

That's what, you know, very generally that's how a reverse mortgage works. But for a retiree, when I just explained to you that, you know, as a retirement, I'm explaining to you that your social security check is no longer going to support your lifestyle. Every dollar you take out of your qualified fund is drawing, lowering your social security even more. You need another source of income. You're sitting in it, it's your house.

SPEAKER_00 39:34

It's their house, right? Right. And that's a brilliant idea, too, because a lot of um what I would have said, because I didn't I asked that question because I didn't know what a reverse mortgage was. Um, I asked that question because my answer would have been you're gonna have to rent the house house. You're gonna have to rent it out. If you want to keep it, that's the only other option I could think of, is you're gonna have to rent the house out. You can't take out any other type of loan because most house loans require um sources of income.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 40:02

And um, to my understanding, if I remember correctly, they don't take social security a lot of times as a source of income. Um, so even if you did make enough money, which you probably don't, um you couldn't use your social security as a source of income to qualify for that loan. So that's why when you initially said that, I was like, oh, their only option would be to sell the house, and the only option to keep it would be to rent it out to tenants. But what elderly person would want to do that? Uh not a lot. Not a lot, yeah. You know, so um that's definitely a good idea. So um you broke down kind of ways can people can go about um planning for their own own retirement. And I and that's where kind of me and you again rely on is don't depend on anybody else but your own self to build up your retirement. So from a general standpoint, we don't have to just keep it in constraints of what we've been talking about. How would you tell somebody? Um, and again, let's play the game, let's do it just how you did it earlier. Let's go with me. I'm 36 years old. So, how would you tell somebody like me to properly prepare for the retirement now? And then let's go to that second person that you mentioned earlier, that person who's about five, 10 years away from retirement, let's say five years away from retirement. How do you tell a 36-year-old and someone that's five minutes away from retirement, how do you go, how do you tell them to retire? How do you go about it?

SPEAKER_02 41:27

So a 36-year-old, I would say first and foremost is contribute to your Roth. If you have a Roth option at work, use that. If you don't, and you're making under the threshold, contribute to a Roth IRA. And then I'm going to use the other four-letter word in the financial industry: cash value life insurance.

SPEAKER_01 41:46

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 41:49

You I tell people that their heads spin around, they hate it. Life insurance is not an investment vehicle. Buy term, invest the rest, all those things. Cash value life insurance is one of the most underutilized financial tools in this country. You put money in post-tax just like a rough. It grows tax deferred, just like a qualified plan. And it comes out, if done properly, tax-free like a rough. There's no income limitations to when you can contribute to it. There's no contribution limitations. There's no time frames as to when you can or must take the money out. And if you pass away before ever using the money, your family gets the death benefit 100% tax free.

SPEAKER_00 42:36

Right.

SPEAKER_02 42:39

So I look at it as a rough on steroids if it's done correctly. The problem is, just like how the financial advisors are greedy, so are insurance agents. They oversell annuities, they oversell life insurance, they don't always do what's best for the client, they do what's best for them a lot of times. So find an advisor, a life insurance advisor, an insurance provider that actually knows the way these policies work, which ones are good, which ones aren't. There's a lot of bells and whistles inside of them. There's a lot of window dressing. You don't need all that. Find a tried and true product. They're there, they work. I have three for my family alone. I truly believe in them. Um, they are one of the most important things a younger person who's earning a good living should be looking at. So Roth, cash value, life insurance, stay away from qualified money. Um, and then, you know, you you do need to invest in non-qualified assets, even though they're not perfect for tax efficiency, they're still better than qualified. So brokerage accounts, manage money. And I'm not saying manage money is bad. I'm not saying that. It's it's you need it, it's a good asset.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

Right.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

But once you give the advisor manage money, don't be afraid to be like, hey, thanks, you've grown it. Now I want to do this with it.

SPEAKER_00 43:57

Right.

unknown 43:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:58

Um, so that's What I would say for the person that's five to ten years away from retirement, life insurance is probably off the table at this point. Um, but where I see life insurance work for those people is they always say, Hey, I have three kids, I want to leave each of them $100,000. So I'm taking $300,000, I'm putting it in a savings account, I'm not touching it. And I'll tell them, Well, that's probably not gonna work because you're gonna need that money. Because if you want to continue this lifestyle, that $300,000 can't be on the sideline. So if you want to leave your kids $300,000, buy a life insurance policy. It's gonna cost you $750 a month, you're done. The kids are taken care of, now your entire Nest egg is yours. Um, I would tell them to start looking into Roth conversions if they haven't done so already. Now Roth conversions are tricky. You have to do them and you have to stop doing them three years before you retire, or at least go on Social Security because a Roth conversion counts towards Irma. So do as much as you can. Don't worry about the taxes now. I know it's a hard pill to swallow, don't worry about the taxes now. Because you're gonna pay them eventually. Pay them now. Don't pay them when you're 80. Um, so rough conversions, and then anything you can't do, I would tell you your first couple of years in retirement, spend down your qualified assets first.

SPEAKER_00 45:26

Got you, got you. Okay. So all good advice. I'm like, all right, taking notes. Gonna watch this episode myself. Um, so my next question to you is um going back to what you do. So clearly you're like the go-to guy for this. Like, if I have any questions, I'm gonna start start sending them your way, definitely for sure. So um, beyond just informing people about how they should go about this, um, how else do you help people um when it comes to all this?

SPEAKER_02 45:59

So, like I said, I have a book coming out right now called The Great American Retirement Myth. Um, that goes into what we're talking about here, just a lot more in depth, obviously. The idea is it's getting people to ask questions. You know, uh, I feel like people treat their financial advisors like elderly people treat their doctors, like with this awe. Like, I can't question them. They're my doctor. Like, no, that's your job. Question them, it's your health. Question your financial advisor. Ask why don't you like an annuity? Why don't you like life insurance? Not why do you like this mutual fund over that mutual fund, but ask questions about the plan they're giving you. Ask questions about taxes, ask what they think is gonna happen with Social Security and Medicare. If they don't have an answer for you, maybe you need a different financial advisor. If they can't tell you the way Social Security and Medicare work, or they can't give you an idea of what they think taxes is going to be taxes are gonna be, maybe you need a new one.

SPEAKER_00 46:58

Right.

SPEAKER_02 46:58

If they can't give you an honest, intelligent explanation as to why annuities are bad or why life insurance is bad, other than they're just not good. Well, why? What makes them not good? If they can't give you that explanation, maybe it's time for a different financial advisor. So what we're doing is we're going across the country and we're finding a collaborative of advisors, insurance professionals, um, RIAs, portfolio managers that are starting to take notice of this, believe in it. They're seeing the impacts it's having, and they're they want to make a change. So we're building a group of people that you can go to. So if you call me up and say, hey, I'm in Indiana, this is my situation, I need help with this. Well, we have somebody over here for you. And maybe you should call this guy because he's in he's part of the group, he's part of the great American retirement myth. He understands what's going on, he'll be able to help you out. So it's just it's really just an awakening of people. Like again, one everyone I talk to, they say, you're right, you know, deferring tax has really never made sense to me. Well, why did you do it? It's because it's what I was told to do. Right. That's the myth.

SPEAKER_00 48:15

Right, right. So I guess one of my last questions, or um, getting towards the end, what do you tell somebody who's already retired? Like, um, just generally speaking, I'm I'm sure you've dealt with people. They're retired, they're one year away from it, maybe they're already in it, they don't have enough money. What do you tell them to do?

SPEAKER_02 48:36

So I do this seminar, I've done it dozens and dozens and dozens of times. And it always attracts a slightly older crowd. I would say 55 plus. Now there'll be people in the room that are 65, 70, 75, and they'll listen to it and they'll go, oh my God, I wish somebody told me this 40 years ago.

SPEAKER_00 48:56

Right.

SPEAKER_02 48:57

I tell them there's always something you can do. Like it might hurt for the next two years, but you're gonna live for another 15. So take it on the chin now to make sure the last 13 years of your life are relatively easy compared to what they're going to be. Don't give up. Don't just say, don't throw your hands up in the air and say, Well, I've been screwed. That's it, that's it for me. Like it might be harder for you, but there's always a way to improve your situation. You just need to have somebody show you the options. And then the other thing I say to them is if you're saying, I wish somebody told me 20 or 30 years ago, that means you probably have a family member, whether it's a child or a grandchild or a niece or a nephew or somebody that's at that age right now. Tell them. Because as bad as you think it is for you, it's getting exponentially worse for them. Because our government debt is going up, our spending is going up, the largest sum of money this country has, the largest sum of wealth is with baby boomers, and eventually it's going to be gone. So things are only going to get worse for people in their 40s and 30s. Make sure they're planning correctly. Have them reach out to us to make sure that they're on the right path. Because I can guarantee the advice they're getting is the same advice you got. And here you are saying you wish it was different.

SPEAKER_00 50:15

Right. Right. What do you so let's go on the I'm gonna ask that same question, but let's just go to someone really young, someone younger than me. Let's talk about our Gen Z and Gen Alpha because I agree with you. They're, I mean, it's it's it's not easy for millennials out here, but man, Gen Z and Gen Alpha. Whoo, man, I I'm I'm praying for that generation because it's not being good for them. So what would you tell somebody like um, like my I have a niece that's 20 years old? How would you kind of talk to them and be like, you know, they're 20, they're probably not even making enough money right now as it is. How do you get them motivated? Or what do you tell them to go, hey, you know, you're 20, at some point in your life, you're gonna you're gonna want to retire, you wanna, you're gonna get to that age where you're not trying to work 80 hours a week, 60 hours a week right now. What do you tell a 20-year-old how to prepare?

SPEAKER_02 51:10

So, what I would tell somebody so young is get in the mind frame of saving instead of just saving. So, whether it's a Roth, whether it's life insurance, whether it's manage money, whether it's any of these things, you have to train yourself to be able to do it. So you're 20 years old. You just say you just got your first job. All right. Start with something you think you can do. Maybe it's $50 a month, maybe it's less, maybe it's $25 a month. Whatever the number is, doesn't matter. It's the idea. Open up a savings account, put $25, $50, 100, whatever your number is in that savings account every month, or break it down to do it every week for a year. At the end of that year, raise the number slightly. So if it was 50, make it 60. If it was 100, make it 120, something like that. Do it for another year. If you can get through two years of doing that, you've now trained yourself to be able to save. Now you can go in and start a Roth. You can start a cash value life insurance policy. You're gonna have this money saved up in the savings account. Just take it out and, you know, jumpstart your cash value life insurance policy. And the $150 you were paying, tell your financial advisor, I can contribute $150 a month. I want a low face amount, high cash value plan. Um, you have to find an advisor that knows how to actually do that because not all life insurance designs are the same. There is a specific way to design one for retirement. And now you're off and running. $150 a month, you're gonna do that. If you can start that by the time you're 23, by the time you're 65, the income that thing's gonna generate for you is gonna be staggering.

SPEAKER_00 53:00

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

Tax-free, no impact on social security, no impact on Medicare. It's it's a small little step. So that's what I would tell them. Two years. Give yourself two years. If you can do it for two years, now you're ready.

SPEAKER_00 53:19

Great advice, great advice. Um, one question for you that popped up as you're explaining was with all this knowledge that you have, do you actually advise people to invest into your 401 and 403B? Or are you just at this point telling them no, don't even put in talking boot, don't even do it. Got it.

SPEAKER_02 53:40

Unless there's a rough option, don't do it.

SPEAKER_00 53:43

Got you. My only caveat is do you still feel that way if the company offers some type of match?

SPEAKER_02 53:48

A match?

SPEAKER_00 53:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:51

So I have mixed feelings on the match. Um, everyone's saying it's free money. Well, yeah, it's free money now, but how much is it gonna cost you then? So say you had a 3% match and you say, Well, I'm gonna put in 3% to at least get my 3%, but now you're deferring 6% of your salary. Let's assume every 10 years that money doubles. You have 30 years of doing this. Now you have a large nest egg of money that's going to affect your social security. So let's just say you were making $100,000 and that was $3,000 a year that the company was putting away for you while you're at your least vulnerable stage working years. But now that nest egg is costing you more money in Irma, what happens if it costs you $5,000 a year in IRMA surcharges during your retirement in your most vulnerable stage? Was it free money at that point, or is it costing you $2,000 a year? Right. So it's a gray area. I don't tell people they're crazy if they're doing it. If you're if you're maxing out your $401k to me, you're crazy.

SPEAKER_00 55:02

Yeah, I agree with that.

SPEAKER_02 55:04

Like if you're maxing it out knowing full well that you're gonna start doing rough conversions, they're gonna do a backdoor Roth because you're making too much money, or your company doesn't have a Roth option. Okay, I could almost buy that. But if you're if you're deferring, if you're maxing out your 401k strictly because you don't want to pay taxes now, you're getting bad advice.

SPEAKER_00 55:28

Yeah, absolutely. And um, that's good to know. I'm gonna start telling people that. That's what I asked, because that's that's what they asked me. Um, I I've historically said just do the match, don't do anything more than that. Only put it in if there is a match.

SPEAKER_02 55:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:43

Um, but I I see where you're coming from too, especially with higher income earners. I can definitely see where they can come into trouble with that later on.

SPEAKER_02 55:51

Yeah, because now what they're gonna do, unless they're putting the money that they're not contributing into a Roth, they're most likely getting it, they're probably not putting it into cash value life insurance, guess their advisor is gonna tell them it's a terrible idea. So they're gonna put it into non-qualified investments. But the problem with non-qualified investments is it's still taxable, it still counts towards Irma. Right. So you're you're reducing, maybe reducing the taxes, but there's still a tax bill. And if you're a high income earner, you know, every every advisor, all they want to do is chase returns. Like, I got 10% last year and I did this. They only care about what they earn, they don't care what you keep.

SPEAKER_00 56:29

Right.

SPEAKER_02 56:30

So again, I I think there is, you know, it's not only it's not only not not where you put your money, not you know, where shouldn't you put your money, it's where should you put your money. Right. You need to tax diversify just as much as your investments are diversified. If I ask people, are you in are you diversified? They'll say, Yeah, I got some small cap, some mid-cap, some international, some bonds. And I say, No, no, that's not what I'm talking about. Are you tax diversified? And they're like, Well, I don't know what that means. I said, out of all the things you have for retirement, how much of it is taxable? And most of the time they go, Well, all of it. So then you're not tax diversified.

SPEAKER_00 57:06

Right. This is all great information. I I really appreciate everything you're doing. I know you mentioned you have a book out. You also mentioned that you do seminars. Is there any what anything other that you do to like put out this information beyond just the book and cinemar and jumping on podcasts like mine?

SPEAKER_02 57:22

Yeah, we have um we have a website that that you can get through through the book website where you can actually get on and you can put in a calculation where it asks your age, your state, what year you want to retire, what your income is, then it asks like general savings, you know, how much you have in qualified plans, how much you have in non-qualified, what is this, what is that, what is this? And you just put in your information and it'll actually calculate what your tax and Medicare burden are for you. And we show it to people and it's eye-opening and it's a free report. You can put it in. Um, there's no charge to use it. You can get it. My book website is retirementmythbook.com. And if you go there, um, you can download a free version, a free uh preview of the book, but then underneath it says run a free report. And if you click on that, it'll bring you right to the website that uh that we had built that does it's a wonderful calculator, did an amazing job. And people can get an idea of what their what their burden is. And the number is scary. It's a scary, scary number. And I ask this all the time at the seminars that I do. I'll show them what the burden is gonna be for somebody, and I'll ask, raise your hand if you have a financial advisor that's prepared you for that number. And zero hands go up every time I ask the question.

SPEAKER_00 58:39

Yeah, well, it is scary. I'm over here, like, all right, I need to I need to re-pivot myself. Um, but it's good information, and and I'm glad that you're out there sharing this information. Because, like you said, at this point, you're the only one that I know who is voicing this information out and giving us a clear breakdown on why it is, what why it's happening, and what to do to better prepare for ourselves. So, game uh so Jim, I really um appreciate you coming on the show. Um, you mentioned your website. Um, is there any other ways people can support you other than just the book?

SPEAKER_02 59:13

Yeah, um, my website, uh theintegrity lb.com. That's my business website. Um on there you can meet my partner, Dan McGrath. So Dan McGrath is actually the one that introduced me to this topic. He was uh he was been in finance forever. He left the financial industry when he learned about Irma because he thought it was just he says he was doing the devil's work. You know, he's like, Well, I was helping people save retirement. I had no idea what retirement was. So, you know, I was a life insurance wholesaler. I was trying to get reasons to buy life insurance, and I heard him speak, and it was all about what we're talking about. This was years ago. And I was like, that's it, that's the message. That's why people need cash value life insurance. And it morphed from that into this whole great American retirement myth. So you can go to the website, you can learn about Dan. Um, you know, he's got information. He's got a book out that he published years ago called uh What You Don't Know About Retirement Will Hurt You. Um, it's the original book on Irma, it's the best-selling book on Irma. He is the the guru. So if you're in Irma or you have a problem with Medicare or you have a problem with your social security, reach out to Dan. His information is right on my website, the integritylb.com. Uh Dan is he knows way more than me about this stuff. So anyone that has questions about that, if if you're in Irma, if you get a if you get a letter the first year you go on Social Security, you have to appeal it. And if you appeal it, there's a very good chance you can get Irma taken away for at least the first or second year, but you have to do it correctly. Dan can help with that.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:43

Okay. And okay, so you say the first, okay, I'm asking for myself. So for the first year, um, when you're on um Social Security or me, it's Social Security disability, um, you just get your you get all the money right away. Um, and then that second year, like I mentioned, that's when every, that's when the Medicare and everything uh kicks in. So you're saying you can actually appeal when that when that all kicks in, Irma, particularly?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:06

You can't appeal Medicare, but Irma, the way Irma works, it's a two-year look back. So let's say you're gonna retire at 67, you're working at 65, you're working at 66, you retire at 67, they look at your last two years' tax returns. If your last two-year tax returns are above a certain threshold of income, your Medicare premium goes up. But now people go, but I'm retired, I don't have that income anymore. So you can appeal it. And if it's appealed correctly, the government will come and say, All right, we see that the bulk of your income is now stopped. You don't have to pay Irma. What you can't appeal a Roth conversion. So if you did a Roth conversion the year before you retired and that Roth conversion put you into Irma, it doesn't matter how much money you make, you're not winning that appeal. Got it. And then after, if you go into Irma because you hit RMDs, there's nothing you can really do. You're stuck.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:01

Got it, got it. Okay. Well, I'm gonna leave it here, you guys. I can keep questioning asking questions all day, but then this is just gonna turn into a personal session with me, and that's not what this is for. Um, Jim, thank you so much for coming on the show. I'm definitely gonna connect with you afterwards um because um this is kind of how I'll wrap up the end of the show. So, one thing that I personally believe in why we do what we do at Financier State of Minds is we believe in the education. Um, we believe in educating our audience and and making sure that they're literate and they understand what's going on with anything to do with money. And I and I always tell people that's all we do. That's and that's all I want to do. It's just the education. Yes, there's partners that we have, but we don't do that. And I make it clear that's through a partnership. You know, we don't, we don't do at this point, um, as of right now, this recording, we don't do any traditional financial services. We have our partners that offer all the financial services. So everything you mentioned, we have a partnership with people who offer it. However, this conversation reinforces what I believed. I just didn't realize how accurate it was to retirement, which is you have to know ultimately, even though there are CPAs, even though there are life insurance agents, even though there are wealth managers and certified financial planners, you have to yourself know at least a certain level of knowledge so that you can correctly guide these people to execute on your financial security. Um because one thing you kept saying, which I can't co-sign, not all these guys even know everything themselves, even though they're the expert, um, which is okay. You know, that's fine as long as they don't claim it. Two, and this is what was so important for me we make our revenue, other, you know, nonprofit side, of course, it's fundraising, but we make our revenue through educating, like right? We are not here, financial state of minds and Darren Harvey myself. I do not sell life insurance policies, I do not offer wealth management or asset management. I do not offer, you know, putting people in 401 or 403Bs. I don't advise any direct on that. On in we don't offer, you know, use this brokerage account or anything like that. We are here to educate because of, like you said, there's all these myths, information, and a lot of times it's it's coming from the inside. It's coming from people who should be steering you in the correct way, and they're not doing it for a BC reason. So it's so appreciated that you are going around and giving clarity and understanding onto something that's clearly outdated, clearly a model that is not the best for most Americans. And that's what I aim to do myself. Um, is hey, you know, yes, I want you to invest, but I'm not gonna tell you how to invest. I'm gonna, these people are gonna tell you, hey, you know, I want you to retire, but you know, I'll take you the basic concepts, but I'm not gonna tell you exactly the avenues. You go to the specialist. Um, and so I appreciate me and you and you especially to just be doing that. We're just doing the education and focusing on the education so that people can decide for themselves and to know that, hey, and I'll have no problem saying this. Yes, if I'm asking for money, it's for the education. That's it. I'm never gonna depend on money um from selling a product.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:34

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:35

Um, so um I thank you again for coming on the show. I really appreciate this. This is one of the few episodes where I'm like, I need to go follow your website, follow your socials, and really learn more about this and um let people know. Um, because um, even though you kept saying retirement, retirement, retirement, and that generally hits at seniority, you know, mean 65 plus. My understanding is social security and social security disability are dang near the same. They operate the same, even though they may come from different pools of money, they operate exactly the same. So, and what I'm here to tell people is you can be disabled and not be able to work at any time. It can happen to you. That's how most people get disabled. Yeah, yeah, it's it just happens. It's not like they just are born disabled, it just happens. Um, so this is great information. Um, I'm gonna look into it more and definitely pass it along into my channels as well. Um, because people need to know this. If I don't know this, like you said, 99% of America doesn't know this.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:37

No, I would agree with that. I I I I think 95% of financial advisors don't know it, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:42

Yeah, absolutely. I agree with you too. So um, Jim, again, thank you for the time. I appreciate you being on the show. And um, you know, we'll we'll follow up and I'm definitely gonna help you with getting this information out because my hypothesis. I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:55

Definitely I'm looking forward to it, Darren. I I appreciate the time and uh keep up the good fight. Yep, absolutely. All right, Jim.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:02

Thank you. Take care.